It turns out that it is very
difficult to get to Syria or another hot spot in the Middle East. Is it
true that they immediately give a lot of money and many benefits, including 50
virgins? What happens to women who find themselves in such places?
“Unusual week” with Inna
Novikova and Yuri Zinin
Yury Zinin, senior
researcher at the Center for Middle East Studies at MGIMO, told Inna Novikova about
this to Pravda.Ru chief editor .
Read the beginning of the
interview:
– Yuri Nikolaevich,
continuing the conversation about terrorist fighters in Syria and the entire
Middle East, of course, it must be said that there are fanatics and mercenaries
from all over the world, including from Russia. Of course, they are also
used for propaganda, including making films with allegedly Russian military for
provocative purposes. As you said, there are women there, including
ours. We remember that even a student at Moscow University, Varvara Karaulova , went there to join the Islamic State group,
banned in Russia *.
– Yes, but this is still a
special case, here the role was played by her purely internal, mental
perception. Of course, terrorists everywhere are trying to recruit people,
but I don’t think it would be widespread, although such attempts have taken
place and continue. Here, the calculation is made on some youthful,
youthful desire to oppose themselves to general trends, mainstream trends, to
stand out with something, play with something.
Young people are always
characterized by a certain romance, disbelief in adults, a desire for
thrills. Here, as they say, even the count on the head is comic, but I
still check it myself or myself. These things can be, of course. But
I would not consider that this is some kind of mass phenomenon, that almost
everyone without exception is infected with this.
Apparently, these are still
separate, rather rare phenomena. And this as a whole, of course, is already
ending. But even earlier, even just to go there and get to the destination
was not an easy task. I can’t even imagine what and how they needed to do
this, although I worked a lot in these countries.
It’s even harder on the
spot. Firstly, it is difficult for our people there climatically, and
secondly, in terms of language. As an Arabic translator, I couldn’t always
clearly understand what they were talking about, because there are a lot of
dialects. How is it to go there without knowing the language at all, and
still take up arms? Generally unthinkable things! How can one live
there? What language to speak, well, I just don’t know …
– They somehow drove through
Turkey, they were helped in this.
– Well yes. But this is
also connected with the life of people, with communication, with the receipt of
all kinds of documents. And it is impossible to imagine that, without
knowing the language, not knowing the culture, the real situation and
everything else, a normal person would decide on this. And in any case,
one must understand that there, a newcomer, whoever he is, becomes a man at the
lowest step of the ladder. And if he is a stranger, does not understand
the local language, he is generally looked at as some kind of slave.
“But there have been, and
probably still are, some recruitment channels.” And people do this
professionally, promise a lot of money and all sorts of benefits, including 50
virgins.
– They
promise. Everything can be. Of course, to promise a lot, to promise a
lot, and when people come to the place, they need to act, they need to report,
they need to speak at least first. But will there be a translator with
everyone there? Our military there complain, are unhappy that there are
few translators in Syria. And these come there, it is not clear to whom
and where, not knowing the language. Well, who will deal with them? …
“But you don’t need to know
the language, they will be given a machine gun or a martyr’s belt – and go,
defend, attack, kill …”
“Go,” so you also need to
know where to go, what to do, how to do it, how much, what and how … This is
also not so simple. At a minimum, it is necessary to explain and
direct. Yes, you can use gestures, of course, but not all and not always,
and usually this is not the best way.
– But still, in a fairly large
number, young people and not only young people went there.
– May be. I just don’t
want the impression that you took it, left and came there and all this is easy
and simple. It is actually very difficult in real life. All this is
very difficult, even to integrate and understand what people say there.
“Have you come across, heard
about such people, talked with those who went there, or tried, or whose
loved ones went?” Are you in charge of ISIS *, which is banned in Russia?
– Well yes. I had such
cases. I worked in some countries, for example, in Tunisia, when there was
a difficult time. There were several of our guys from the Caucasus who
studied in local regions in institutions. Every evening they came to the
Russian Cultural Center and watched a movie, because there they could not find
anything interesting.
Here they were students, and
every evening they came to our cultural center and had fun there, watched a
movie, participated in other events. You see, all the same, there is its
own very narrow and strict system of clans. There you need to enter into
friendship with someone to become more or less your own. But everything is
very difficult to do. Some obligations need to be fulfilled, something
else to be done. It’s all very complicated, you know? …
Some of our women also got
there. But they are generally mostly widows.
– Black Widows?
“There are options
here.” They are, as it were, not entirely widows, but as the Islamists
themselves declared: “We have no widows.” What plan is there no
widows? Now, if, for example, a man is killed, then his wife is
automatically transferred to another. Although this also completely
contradicts all the laws of Sharia, Islam. And after some time, she again
falls into the same situation when her roommate is killed or disappears.
She is thrown to the next,
and she is forced, because someone has to feed her. Some have many
children, it is not known from whom and even what nationality the father
was. And this happens all the time. In general, this is already some
kind of degradation, decadence …
Someone, perhaps, was
deceived by their propaganda, slogans. Of course, these pictures can be
shown there, there are television masters who show the picture – some kind of
house is big in a beautiful place and everything else. But in general,
people live there more than modestly, and even more so if the country is in
such a situation … And suddenly a new person arrives, what is he there at all?
… Therefore, I look at this with skepticism.
* Organization banned in
Russia.
Interviewed Inna Novikova
Prepared for publication by
Yuri Kondratyev
Читайте больше на https://www.pravda.ru/world/1455403-zinin/
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